The most outspoken saxophonist on the
planet? Probably. But GILAD ATZMON turns the
tables yet again, and lets the music do the
talking, on his latest album The Tide Has Turned,
but he still has plenty to say, as ANDY ROBSON
discovers
They call him the hardest-working man in jazz.
But even by his standards, its been a
hectic time for Gilad Atzmon lately. Its
breakfast time on a Tuesday and he has still not
had the chance to get off the ever-ringing phone.
I have never been so fucking stressed in my
life, admits the sax man, ripping out his
earpiece and finally snapping off the phone.
On Friday it was Ronnies and the
Orient House launch, last night was Jazza For
Gaza at which we launched Robert Wyatts
album; tonights the second night of Jazza
and then its back to the Orient House tour
which is our biggest ever. Oh, and Im
working on Sarah Gillespies album for the
new year.
Just for a moment, the Big Man looks tired,
vulnerable even, despite his reputation for
outspokenness, although his forthright views
could be seen as coming from a position of
endless questioning, putting assumed knowledge to
one side.
On another occasion, Atzmon has talked about
this other Gilad. I guess that
Gilad, as far as I know him, is a very insecure
being; he searches constantly and relentlessly
for answers with the hope of never finding an
adequate one. I do music because I love to be
transformed. Music and jazz in particular has
this capacity to reinvent itself. I love to
reinvent myself constantly. This is why I play
the sax; this is why I can hardly read music;
this is why I write, and write and write. I dont
let my ideas settle. I question them before they
see daylight.
Breakfast though isnt the time for
doubts: its a time to carb load on rich
buttered scones, and how can you be down when
theres so much to do? When on the big
screen behind us theyre lifting the Chilean
miners one by one from their living entombment
spread over some 69 long days. Musicians, writers,
heh, we have it lucky.
Atzmon knows this better than most. The last
time we met two years ago to discuss In
Loving Memory Of America his subsequently
much acclaimed album with the Sigamos Quartet,
the televisual backdrop had been bloodier, tragic,
hopeless. Atzmon, powerless before Al Jazeeras
coverage, had been rendered silent by the Israeli
bombardment of Gaza. We always thought,
he says, if they came with tanks to kill
children we would stop them. They do that now and
we cant stop them. These are hard questions
and I do not know the answer.
More unknowing. Yet, somehow, like the miners
rising blinking into the light, Atzmon, has come
to address, if not answer, that question. Part of
the answer is in the title of the new album, The
Tide Has Changed. Originally the album was a
celebration of a decade of The Orient House
Ensemble. You know it was Franks band,
he says, Frank being Harrison, still the erudite
pianist in the ensemble, and the only Brit to
have survived the course. He asked me to
play with him at a fundraiser before he went to
Berklee. And I just took over being an
Israeli, Atzmon says, grinning. Atzmons
jokes may not be to everyones
taste, but he plays constantly with his own
persona. Hey, Im a chameleon. Thats
a Jewish thing, like Zelig. Its no
coincidence that Woody Allen came up with Zelig.
Jews are known to be chameleons. Sure, its
a problem critics have with me, be they from the
Left or the Right. They say hey, one minute he
says hes an ex-Jew, then he says hes
not! But Im an artist, its my
privilege to change. At least I own my
discrepancies! And with this the chameleon
laughs again. Anyway Frank lasted for six
months at Berklee, and meanwhile Asaf Sirkis came
to London from Israel.
Sirkis arrival was seminal. With
Asaf, I smelled this blossom of Palestine. And I
was already very angry with Israel. So my
original idea was to take Jewish music and
Palestinise it so Jews are able to see the misery
of Palestine through their own culture. I took
Jewish songs about The Return and put Arab music
and lyrics to them. It wasnt a success in
Israel.
Yet it found an audience in the UK. The name
of the band, taken from the PLOs base in
Jerusalem in the 1980s, may not have had the
resonance for audiences that it had for Atzmon,
but after a decade of hard gigging and a slew of
albums, including one that became BBC Jazz Album
of the Year, the OHE has built a loyal following.
Yet at the turn of the millennium, Atzmons
vision was high risk. We did the first gig
at the Watermill in Dorking. Id played
there five or six times as a bop man and then I
went back with Orient House doing all this note-bending
and Arabic stuff. I couldnt even do it very
well! It was outrageous to go and play our big
Jewish crap. Some guy yelled play some Bird!
Im like Oh shit. But the whole
crowd shouted him down: they were loving it!
A decade on and audiences have grown to
embrace the ensembles mix of jazz grooves,
bop, Middle Eastern and Balkan vibes. Its
not only the musical tide that has changed.
The tide has changed because we all are
aware of the Palestinian plight, explains
Atzmon.
Everyone knows I am committed to this
Palestinian thing. People ask me Gilad,
what can I do? And the only thing we can do
is talk about it freely. What has changed for me
is that weve talked, though it is still a
disaster for the Palestinians, and I see more
people aware. In 1967 when Israel invaded the
whole world cheered, but by 1982 things started
to change. People saw this country was aggressive
beyond belief. In 2008 the bombardment of Gaza
led to people changing their views, and again the
events around the flotilla raised even more
issues.
The Israeli boarding of the peace
flotilla in international waters in May led to
the deaths of nine people. You know I was
asked to go to Gaza with the Jewish flotilla, but
I said no. I want a dinghy of me and the self-haters!
But now I have an idea to put this whole Jazza
festival on a bus and to tour music for Palestine
all over the world! I dont argue that
musicians should have a political commitment but
some of us do. We can raise money and people
listen to us. They listen to us because we arent
driven by power. We are driven by the search for
beauty. You cannot say about Cameron that he is
driven by the search for beauty. Or David
Miliband. Or Ed.
It is this search for beauty that transfigures
Atzmons often tortuous political logic.
Look, Im not in politics because I
dont believe in politics. All politicians
let us down. But I took this from Robert Wyatt. I
am an anti-racist. People are entitled to life
and to celebrate their differences. I am not a
multi-culturalist but I am against any measures
of repression that are racially motivated. This
is an ethical, not a political question.
Its not only the Israeli state that
feels his anger. British tolerance is so
hypocritical. The only place you see real
equality is on stage between musicians. On stage
at Jazza we had Palestinians, Jews, Blacks,
Gypsies: unbelievable.
But this is no plea for multi-culturalism.
Atzmon may sound like Angela Merkel, but hes
arguing from a very different place to the German
Chancellor. I want to see English people
celebrating their cultural, um, symptoms? The
best thing that came out of this country in the
last 70 years has been The Beatles, Surman,
Taylor, McLaughlin, Holdsworth, Dave Holland. Did
they grow up with multi-cultural crap? No, they
found their voice by protesting against an
Englishness they didnt accept. They found
their own language, like McLaughlin found it
through Konokol, the south Indian rhythm language.
But multi-culturalism isnt the
way to do it. That flattens everything, makes
everyone the same. We need a celebration of
manifold cultures. And in that sense, the
contemporary Left is very banal. I think England
is now at its lowest point for generations. But
we have the human power to bounce back in a
matter of days.
Yet how, when were facing the biggest
cuts in public spending since the second world
war? Atzmons message is a tough one. Im
not moaning. I am a chatter box. When people hear
me, they know Im not malicious, I just want
a better world. We want to tell young musicians,
You know what, you dont need a
fucking Arts Council grant! Let the Tories
destroy everything, let them take the money and
give it to the Olympics. You dont need
their money. What you need is to be capable of
doing the thing you like to do. Ironically, the
collapse of infrastructure may be the best thing
for music. For decades in this country the only
art form has been filling in forms to claim money
for the arts! You know, once I was even asked
about the sexual orientation of my band. I dont
even know what my sexual orientation is!
And jazz education can go in the same bin as
arts funding, according to Atzmon. There is
a big crime in the colleges. Let us say 2,000
students in the country join jazz education. But
when they come out there are only 45 places to
play. It creates a great educated audience,
he laughs. But these kids leave Trinity,
Leeds, the Royal College with 28k debts. Jazz is
not a profession. Its an occupation, not a
way to make a living. Eddie [Hick who
paradoxically Atzmon discovered as a student]
leaves Leeds, gets a job with me but hes
not going to get rich, not from me! Maybe he gets
a Matt Bianco tour and hes better off.
Atzmon is happy to sound like an old man
of the right as he puts it. I learned
from Heidegger that to teach is to teach students
how to learn. You do not plant information. You
plant enthusiasm. I have played with guys
straight from college and found them completely
lame. But the good ones are strong enough to take
my abuse, he laughs again, scoffing another
scone.
Then they find a voice and are no longer
lame English boys. Why are Frank and Eddie the
only English in my band? I tried others. But
after two days on the road they collapse. But
then look at The Blockheads. They are 10 years
older than me but they play, they drive, they
talk. They are like soldiers, this older
generation of English musicians. Look at them, at
Peter King, hell drive from Wales, do the
gig, drive back in the middle of the night.
Soldier mentality.
In the mid-1980s we developed a spoiled
generation. But the next generation? And at
that Atzmon nods toward a friend whose teenage
son has applied to Trinity, they will learn
that if jazz music is something they want to do,
then great. But they will have no-one waiting to
give them a job when they get out of college. It
will be a struggle.
Yet heres the rub. Struggle is
good. We have forgotten that. I saw my father
working in a factory. He struggled. But it was
the meaning of his life. He was struggling for
something. For meaning. So it was very natural
then for me to play fast, loud, slow and
beautiful. You have to come with a story. Who
wants to read what a musician has to say, eh? It
is not enough to say I play bop because I like it!
But now, within the context of the struggle for
Palestine, music makes more and more meaning for
me. Though I do not know what the meaning is.
This is where I am.
Atzmon demolishes another scone. The tide
prepares to change again; and another miner comes
out into the light.